Advice on Toad

[sacs4010]

OK, so Toad rarely if ever comes out of hiding. He is ALWAYS huffy and puffy when I take him out. Even when I give him food or treats. Any advice? I am a patient person, so I can wait and work with him to calm him down. It seems he is not so much as scared of me, more so that he is annoyed with me. lol

[Fatal_S]

Does he stop huffing/puffing after you're holding him? Huffing is a normal behaviour when you disturb a skink. It's not aggressive, and even tame BTS often huff when taken from hiding. If it's accompanied by hissing, tongue-wagging, shielding or gaping, then it's a bit more defensive.

How often do you interact with him?

[Coomassie]

Indigo is also still huffy, although less so. When I got Coomassie he was still a bitty baby. My experience is once he hit around a year old, he calmed down significantly. Although, even Coomassie huffs at me on occasion. I think part of it is something bigger than them getting too close and they are saying "hey, watch out what you are doing, I'm sitting here!".

[Susann]

I always advice people to not touch them unless you're grabbing or holding them. And when you're holding them, move your fingers as little as possible. If you have a habit of "petting" him, stop it. Being petted makes most young skinks very uneasy.

I'd also advice you to find a space where he can have stuff to explore and check out while you're sitting "ground-level" with him --like block off an area of a hallway and sit on the floor, or on top of a couch with you in the middle, having laid out stuff for him to check out on either side of you. If he is interested in checking things out, then pick him up every now and then, as if to move him --not to hold (certainly not to pet), just pick him up and put him down in a different spot. Or if he just stops moving around, pick him up and put him down in a different place. If he is interested in exploring, you may notice fairly quickly that he huffs less when you reach for him.
Do this every day.

I've also noticed that some babies get more nervous and huffy when you talk to them; keep an eye on that, and if that seems to be the case, (and this is REALLY hard) then don't make any sounds when he's huffing.

Unless he's a "violent grabber", try carefully finger-feeding him chunks of his favorite snack.

If these things don't seem to make a difference after a while, this may seem cruel to some, but you can try the tough love method of removing his hides. This works wonders on some shy, hidey skinks.
And I'd still be taking him out every day for "explore" time.

[DianaBlueTongue]

try hand feeding favorite treats often and limit that encounter to just the treat. this has been working really well to calm down a baby northern I got this year, he would bite constantly when reached for and while in hand but now only does it a little when first reached for but sits pretty still and calm in hand. if they start to associate your hands with something positive he might not be as inclined to immediately become defensive. In general meraukes tend to be a bit more timid and shy then northerns, of course theres always exceptions to anything, just talking is generalities, so it might just take a bit more time for him to come round.

[sacs4010]

Thank you so much for your helpful responses everyone. Let me go through these questions. lol Yes, he stops huffing after I pick him up. He only does the huffing. From what I can tell he is skittish, but not really scared. I think he just gets annoyed. Like a child who does not want to hug an elderly family member. lol I interact with him less since he keeps urinating on me and defecating where I let him roam. lol It seems he finds the cleanest spot and then decides to defecate. I do tend to "pet" him. I did not know that they do not like that. He is much calmer when I am holding him, but I know he wants to get loose and explore. He walks all over me when he is out and hanging out with me on the couch. I just get so nervous he will fall off the couch and run under something that would be unsafe for him to be under. The biggest issue with allowing him to explore is that I live in a studio apartment. There is just no where safe for him to explore very much. I need to make some kind of tunnels or something for him to explore around my bathroom or a way to make sure he does not get anywhere that is unsafe. I have hand feed him grapes a few times. He gets nervous at first because my hand is closer to his head. He does not run or anything, but you can tell he is being weary. He then of course eats it. He does not grab it forcefully and is so far gentle. How am I suppose to take him out every day if he keeps peeing and pooping on me? lol Right now I only take him out if I have it setup for him to explore a little bit, or when I feed him. So he only gets taken out of his enclosure for good things. What do you guys think?

[Carnivale]

For the peeing and pooping, you need to be mindful of the time of day you're taking him out, and how long it's been since you fed him. For my own girl, she usually poops and pees around noon, which is roughly the time I typically feed her as well. But if I take her out and about any time after 4pm, usually she won't be having any accidents on me.

[sacs4010]

I have had it happen at all different times. Even after I wait a few days after feeding him. lol

[DianaBlueTongue]

peeing and pooing is a natural defensice for baby reptiles to try and get whatevers bothering them to leave them be. most important thing to remember with that is to not give him the reaction he's hoping for, which is you putting him back in his cage. as gross as it sounds, let him go on you. maybe put a towel in you lap while having him out. if he starts to realize its not working as a deterant it'll start to happen less and less. also with peeing, remember going from inactive to active get the bodies bowels moving and usually propels a poo down the chute.

sounds like you and him are on the right track actually, just keep interacting with him often, maybe once a day for 10-15 minutes. Try setting up a playpen or something for him to roam around in without the worry of him running under the fridge or something

[sacs4010]

Great, just sucks I will have to wash so many sheet, towels, etc. lol If I set up a playpen for him, any suggestions on what to put in it?

[Fatal_S]

Peeing and pooping when out isn't fear, it's a natural part of being active. When you start moving your body starts moving and things get flowing. It's why runners often feel the need to hit the bathroom mid-run.

One option is to let him roam on a poop-safe area until he goes. Once they go once, they usually won't go again unless scared. I know some people use the grass outside, or some people use the bathtub.

Another option is to let him roam wherever, and just catch the poop when it comes. Have you started to learn the signs of imminent-poop? For example the wiggly walk, raised tail, & tucked-up legs? Keep some paper towel handy, and when the tail goes up, put the towel under him. He poops on the paper towel, which is easy to toss, and you don't have to wash all your laundry daily.

[Romeyrider]

Fatal S said what I was going to say. Once they start moving their bodies around their intestines move with it. Would it be possible to let him roam around outside for a few minuets then when he goes you can put him inside. You can always have special poop sheet. This can be a blanket, towel, or actual sheet. If you like to hang out with him and your in bed lay the poop sheet down and then you guys lay on top of it. You obviously will clean the poop up with a toilet paper and then you can remove the sheet and be assured he's done doing his thing. But if he has diarrhea then keep him on the sheet because they will go more than once. I read somewhere that baby bluies go to the bathroom more than once a day also. After a couple of uses you will need to wash the poop sheet in the actual washer.

[Romeyrider]

Fatal S said what I was going to say. Once they start moving their bodies around their intestines move with it. Would it be possible to let him roam around outside for a few minuets then when he goes you can put him inside. You can always have special poop sheet. This can be a blanket, towel, or actual sheet. If you like to hang out with him and your in bed lay the poop sheet down and then you guys lay on top of it. You obviously will clean the poop up with a toilet paper and then you can remove the sheet and be assured he's done doing his thing. But if he has diarrhea then keep him on the sheet because they will go more than once. I read somewhere that baby bluies go to the bathroom more than once a day also. After a couple of uses you will need to wash the poop sheet in the actual washer.

[DianaBlueTongue]

when I make play pens for my blueys to explore I put a nice variety of activities in with them. Some things are small sections of wide pvc pipes for little "tunnels", maybe a small pile of rags or hand towels to burrow around in, a couple dishes with favorite treats, and I made a bin out of a 16 quart storage tub with a big hole cut in the top and filled with shredded newspaper.

Another fun activity to stimulate their mind is to get one of those dog toys that's in the shape of a ball that has a small hole in the side to stuff treats in. I stuff mine with cut up snail, scrambled egg, and maybe pieces of banana. Not one of my skinks ignored it after realizing what was in it, just try to find one with a bigger opening so they can get bits out here and there so they don't get frustrated and loose interest. The one I use has an opening that lets bits of treats fall out as the skink rolls it so they get rewarded by playing with it. Next time ill try n take a video, its pretty cute to watch

[DianaBlueTongue]

oh, and I went to the dollar store and bought a pile of large and small towels that are specifically bts towels. You can wash them or just throw them out and get more since theyre so cheap

[sacs4010]

I have learned the signs of when he is going to urinate and/or defecate. lol I do not think a paper towel could handle catching his urination. Right now there is no where for him to roam around outside. There are no real open areas that have a low risk of him getting into somewhere dangerous. I will look around outside better though and perhaps I missed a good area. All great ideas everyone. I will keep you guys up to date on my progress. Thanks!

[sacs4010]

OK, so we did well today. I took Toad out and allowed him to roam around my computer desk. I put a towel down and sure enough he evacuated over it. I did nothing until he moved away. I then just picked up the feces and let him roam around. I then let him climb all over me and my chair. I then took a BIG risk and allowed him to roam a little bit on my bed. I then put him away. He huffed a little if I surprised him and he did not liked to be touched. He was so excited roaming around. lol I also gave him a small grape as a treat. So things are looking better. Thanks to everyone's advice! I will update again soon.

[DianaBlueTongue]

Aw yay! That's great news! He'll come round in no time, the fact that he's not a type A personality (like swings round open mouthed every time you touch him or charges you open mouthed with full intentions of biting) is a great starting point anyway. Sounds like he's just a bit unsure but with lots of positive interactions like the one you described only good things will follow.

[joan]

For me, I've noticed that Gronk won't get huffy if he's actually wanting to come out, which is basically when he's hungry. When he's hungry, he barely even flinches when I reach in and pick him up (not even breathing harder/faster). He only gets a little huffy if I take him out when he doesn't want to come out (i.e. not hungry). I tend not to pet him, probably mostly because petting lizard skin is not particularly...reinforcing? I think most people tend to pet furry animals because the soft fur feels good and relaxes them. I can't say the same about smooth, hard lizard skin. But maybe that's me. And coincidentally, most lizards don't seem to care for it. some at least seem to not mind their throats/chin stroked a little, but I'm not going to say they like it.

That said, I do want Gronk to get used to being "petted" only because I know that's the first thing everyone does when they meet an animal. So, while he's scarfing his meals, I've started lightly touching and stroking Gronk from his head to the tip of his tail. I'll even lightly touch his legs and feet. He does not react at all when I do this while he's eating. I have no idea whether this will help in the long run, for when he's not eating, but since this doesn't seem to bother him, I'll just do it. Time will tell.

Also, I don't usually get him out of the tank until he's been moving around a little and poops first. Then I know he won't when I take him out. But perhaps this will get harder when he's bigger and doesn't necessarily poop within the first half hour of being out and about in his tank...

[sacs4010]

So I have been taking Toad out just about every day. I will be taking him out here in a minute to get a treat (raspberry) and to chill. He REALLY want to roam around. So I NEED to make something for him to do so safely. I thought he had something caught in his eye the other day and even though he did not enjoy it, he allowed me to wipe his eye a little bit with a very damp paper towel. I want to switch to Aspen shavings, but living in Phoenix, Arizona makes keeping his enclosure at about 50% humidity difficult with Aspen for bedding. So I am using the ZooMed forest floor bedding. I need to get creative and make something for him to explore and something that I can change up from time to time.