New BTS always hiding

[Dani04]

Hi all
My daughter purchased a captive bread northern Australian BTS the first week of December. We were told it was about 4-5 months old and had been eating daily. When in the store she handled her and the skink was pretty curious and did not appear distressed. The enclosure is 70 gallons, has several hides on both warm and cool sides. The first 48 hours home she did come out a few times to bask but did not eat for several days. She did finally eat about 5 days in and has since ate on the sly every 3-4 days. My concern is she is never out— always hiding. My daughter has gone looking a few times concerned she is ill or not alive and gets hissed at so she backs off. I read they need to be handled often to increase social behavior but my daughter doesn’t want to break trust - saying if she is hissing she wants space. We know there’s an adjustment period but it has been almost a month and want to know if we should try anything else. The temps are good and her light is on 12 hrs a day. We have tried many different veggies, snails and canned cat food. The only thing she has eaten is the cat food. Any advice is appreciated. Thanks

[Janella]

Hello there. So each skink is different when it comes to personality. You said the temps are correct, but what are they? Also what have you done to try to earn your skinks trust? I strongly suggest talking to it, doing small gentle pets here and there. Also offer treats such as banana , blueberries, and/or snails. When you offer the veggies and other items are they blended in with a good protein source or just chopped up on plate? I recommend blending the food together so the skink can't pick out the things it likes only. Once your skink seems better with you by talking and offering treats, you can slowly start handling. I would go very slow with handling. They need to feel secure and their bodies need to be supported. I hope this helps a little bit.

[IvanDanko]

To add to the above, as you haven't had the skink from birth its hard to know its actual character - remembering that leaving the only environment it has known is also quite a stressful event. It is also important to avoid establishing negative learned behaviours for her skink i.e. everytime the skink hisses she backs off. The skink will then learn that is an effective method to deter you. The same applies to if it runs away whenever someone enters the room and then is always left to hide. If possible, commit to regular handling - handle the skink as suggested above once you have initiated the process. Use small treats initially fed by hand (avoid doing this excessively and only on occasion) - this usually encourages the skink to come out. Then you can work from there. Give it time and the skink will come around

[Dani04]

Thank you both for the prompt reply. My daughter talks and has held her hand in as well— but with her hiding not sure if she was awake during that time. After posting yesterday we did some more reading of past questions and decided to get a temp gun. Previously only had a sensor. What we learned is that the cool side of the enclosure (where she tends to burrow is cooler than we had thought). We try to keep the warm side 85-90 and cool 75-80 during the day and 75 and 70 at night. Found out it had been dipping to 65-68 at night. Currently we have an mat heater and a mercury vapor bulb on the warm side. Going to look at getting a ceramic heater. Also thinking the basking area is not warm enough but not sure how to increase the temp safely.
Food wise she had been chopping up and mixing veggies and cat food. The snail (pet store supplied us with frozen) was untouched— should we have chopped that up? Tried banana twice (untouched).
Thinking now she may be just not warm enough, hopefully bringing up temps will get her more curious. Thinking now she may have gone into brumation
Attached is the picture of the enclosure and a picture of the skink the day we brought her home.

[Dani04]

Also going to find a thermostat as I am now thinking about the temp of the enclosure 24/7

[Janella]

The temps are for sure to low. The basking area needs to be at least 100. Then the cool side around 70 at the lowest. You may have to play around with different bulbs or the heat emitter until you get the temps you need. The temp could definitely be a reason for not eating well.

[Dani04]

Picked up a ceramic heater will have to order thermostat as stores out of stock. Now worried about over heating— what is the max on cool and warm side?

[IvanDanko]

Aim for hot side air temp range: 85-95°F
Basking spot (refer to Janella's post above)
Cool side air temp range: 70-80°F
Night: no lower than ~70°F


Once you get a thermostat you will be able to program this in effectively, depending on the model and features over a 24 hour period. IMO thermostat either on/off or dimmable should be included in any base set-up, I'm not sure if the store recommended this.

[Dani04]

Thank you! They had me set up with a mercury vapor bulb and the heating pad. Starting to think maybe that bulb is not working correctly. The basking spot at its warmest is 85, cage is 48x18x18, just changes the basking “log” out for rock thinking it may hold heat more effectively. Once I have the thermostat I will use for the ceramic heater and set it to 90 on the warm side— or better 85?

[IvanDanko]

A solution to create a warmer basking area is to elevate it towards the lamp - rocks placed on top of one another are useful for this.

Generally rocks make a great choice for the basking spot - you can use multiple over an area to absorb heat and give a nice range of temperatures. Just make sure you place them on the floor of the enclosure and do not allow space underneath/in-between and the rocks are stable. Skinks love to burrow and are deceptively strong, they can shift rocks easily and become trapped/injured.

[mb606587]

Personally don't believe your night temperatures are an issue. My skinks regularly see temperatures of 65° overnight during the winter. Depending on how you're measuring your temperatures, day time temperatures may be low. There is a difference between the ambient air temperature and surface temperature. For example, on a 95° day, the air feels hot but the pavement or sand on the beach may not be able to be walked on in bare feet. Most people recommend basking rocks because they heat up so well and reptiles are observed in the wild utilizing the piping hot surface. So a 92° degree air temperature measured higher up in the enclosure may actually be causing the basking surface to heat up substantially hotter. I always recommend using a heat gun to measure the surface. I find temperatures around 110°-115° measured on the surface with this instrument produce excellent results, with some even utilizing hotter surfaces than that.

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[Dani04]

Update:
Thank you all for your help. We now have in addition to the large mercury vapor bulb, a ceramic bulb and a basking bulb. I disconnected the heater pad. We plan to use ceramic at night and the other 2 from 10a-10p. Right now temp in the basking area is 108, warm side is 96 and cool 74
Now we are just praying she will come out of % to bask and/or eat. Should we go looking for her or give her a few days in the warm to come out on her own?
Worried we have unintentionally made her ill.
Thanks again

[Dani04]

We checked on her yesterday she was burrowed in the middle of the enclosure under the water dish (not heavy and 3”-4” mulch underneath). She hissed and appeared to not be losing weight. We moved some food very close to hear and covered her back up.
I placed a camera on the enclosure to see if she is moving around while we were not in the room , so far 17 hrs no action.
Thinking the cooler temperatures for a few weeks resulted in her going into brumation. Will the corrected temps expedite her coming out? Is there anyway to very brumation? We are worried but do not want to keep disturbing her if she is ok.

[splashy07]

Brumation at this time of year is natural for northern bts. If she chooses to, let her. It is an important part of their life cycle. Disturbing will only cause stress. If she has good weight there is no need to worry. Just let her be and she will live a longer happier life.

[Dani04]

Ok makes sense. So that would mean I she drop the temps? Or is it ok I let it stay above 70 at night and during the day 85-95 on warm side with basking 110 and 75-80 on cool side?

[splashy07]

No need for cool down unless breeding.

[Dani04]

Phew! Thanks will leave be for now:)

[Dani04]

Thank you to everyone that provided advice back in December/January. We had the enclosures temps regulated appropriately and well as the lights. Its now April 10, (this behavior started around December 10th), and he is still not coming out to eat or bask. He does (we think) come out to get water, and has pooped once. He hissing if you try to find him under the substrate and often squirms a bit when we are misting the enclosure. Since we got him days before this started we are not sure if indeed he is still brumating or if he is 100% afraid and not eating.
How late can brumation go into April?