Having some trouble with my Merauke

[stinky]

I've had him for 2.5 years now, last year I took him to the vet because of straining to poop and he had protozoan flagelletes and giardia. During the treatment for those parasites he also got a respiratory infection. It was a nightmarish 3-4 months of trying to cure him of these ailments. Before the treatment he was curious about me and even voluntarily walked up my arm once. Now he is definitely untrusting of me. I'm not sure if this is normal but he seems to take quick breaths and pause for a moment before breathing again, sometimes appearing to breath shallow and irregularly. When I do pick him up, usually to bathe him because he walked through some yuck, it's the worst thing in the world. He flails and freaks out. Just now I attempted a short handling session. He flings his feet out and flails his tail even though I'm supporting his whole body with my forearm. He digs his claws into my skin and makes gasping/squeaking sounds as he tries to run from my hands; the hand walking technique I use with my feisty beardie is impossible with my skink. I'm afraid he's going to hurt himself from all the straining. He exhausted himself and sat in the cage panting afterwards.

I'm not sure what to do, have any of you guys had a skink that behaves like this? After the treatment last winter I gave him plenty of space. Recently I had been making some progress with him. I talk to him and spend time by his cage, and sometimes he comes out to investigate me. I was able to touch him without him flinching, so I thought handling by the cage would be the next step, but this seems like a step backwards. I'm not sure how to move forward, another challenge I face is that he is often hiding. If I remove the hides from him, won't that stress him? And if so, how am I supposed to work on desensitizing him from handling?

Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated. This isn't quite what I had in mind when I bought a skink, I'm feeling quite discouraged. I want a curious interactive pet, not one that is terrified of me. :/
Thanks

[tcopitho]

From what you describe in your first paragraph he sounds very stressed. He has been through some very stressful but necessary experiences, don't give up on him. Its going to be a long road to building his confidence back up, but achievable.

The progress you've made inside of his enclosure is very positive and keep working that. For your outside tank experience, don't focus on keeping him near the tank, his proximity to his home will likely not serve to relax him. Try taking him to a place (in the same room if you can, since carrying him is an issue as well) where you can calmly sit with him on your lap. He will likely try to find somewhere to hide, maybe try holding him in a towel or sweater, something that will provide him some security. Even sitting with him completely wrapped up in a towel for a while, which will allow him to relax while not in his enclosure is positive. For mine, when they venture off to hide in the couch cushions, I calmly pick them back up and place them back on my lap, I may do this many times in a row. The key is doing it slowly and calmly. Only work with him out for five to fifteen minutes a day, or every couple days.

Definitely try feeding only when he is out and about. One of mine was very skittish and used to loose his little marbles when Id take him out, so trying to feed him his weekly meal while out of his cage really was a bust. I ended up finding a treat he couldn't refuse, for him it was snails, I started by giving them to him while in his enclosure (use tongs if your hands proximity causes stress), and then eventually when the snail is a real established treat, he would take them outside his tank. It can also be used to bait your bluey out from under a hide, once they are familiar with the smell of their favorite treat, it doesn't take much more than holding it in font of a buried nose or flicking tongue. I dont suggest picking him up after baiting him out, at least not for a while, one thing at a time.

Now for the trust issues when being carried, one of my skinks used to flail when I carried her, like you describe, the motion of being lifted straight up or down scared her. She would pinwheel her tail, dig in her claws, and just basically over react. The method that got her through this was very simple, as soon as she starts to show signs that she was going to thrash I would immediately stop moving her, which would generally diffuse her reaction. I would then continue slowly, rinse and repeat. The key was to give her time to calm down on her own, since there is basically no action I could take that would have helped, except to take myself out of the situation. In that case the least I could do was halt the action that was causing the stress. Try to anticipate and react before his stress peaks.

If you know he is going to dig in with his claws make sure to wear long sleeves, you do not want to react in defensive/negative way (shirking away from the pain of his claws) that will add to the fear of the situation.

Since your boy sounds like he might be a little more extreme a case than my girl was, something I found that helped her a lot would be to wrap her in a towel and then transport her, (not full on, but lengthwise so her head could see out one end and tail out the other, like a hammock) for whatever reason that gave her far more security. You can also hold the towel right up to the enclosure entrance when done your session for the day and let the skink walk out of it back into his home. A lot of the time there is a frenzy in that moment from your hand back into their enclosures, so this defuses that moment of stress.

I hope some, if any of this is helpful to you, there isn't really a one size fits all method for these things, and I am no expert. There are many other threads on this forum for taming a bluey, definitely queue up the search function and read through some of the other stuff. I know its easy to get discouraged, unfortunately when we purchase our pets we never can know what we will be in for. You've done great with your bluey so far, getting it the vet attention it needed to be healthy. Im hopeful that you will give it more time and continue your efforts so that you can enjoy a confident and happy lizard.

Your images don't seem to be working, Id love to see your bluey.

[alichamp]

Some great help from tcopitho so I don't have much more to add. Looks like you just need time and persistence to rebuild positive experiences of handling. He has come to learn that every time you hold him he has to have medicine or a bath. You just now need to convince him otherwise. I personally would make sure he still has his hides in there, you are right that taking them away will stress him out and he will not feel safe.

The FAQs has threads on safely holding your skink and taming suggestions. Have you read through those?

[stinky]

tcopitho, I want to thank you for taking the time to write such a thorough and thoughtful post. There is a lot of advice there that I think will be helpful. I think I'll start with continuing working with him in the enclosure and work on the baiting from hides, that's an awesome idea. My bluey loves snails too! But he also loves food in general, his appetite is truly inspiring. I was wondering, does a breathing rate of about one breath every second seem about right for them or is that really fast pace for them to breathe? I'm sorry if that's a weird question, it's just he can be so nervous around me that I can't really be sure what a calm skink looks like anymore.

Bad news, I noticed today some symptoms of possibly developing a respiratory infection again, so back to the vet we will go. This really isn't going to help my reputation with him. I really hope it's not the case though and I'm just being paranoid.

alichamp, thank you for your reply as well. You're right, I will have to buy his trust with food and pleasant experiences, it may take a long time. I've read the FAQs before and searched threads for help a long time ago. Usually I read about skinks that people have just acquired, and I've had my guy for so long and he seems so uncontrollably terrified when I take him out of his cage. I was watching youtube videos to see how other people hold their skinks, and found that some would be picked up completely improperly yet seem totally relaxed!
A picture of him and his current set up:

forumpicresize.jpg

An older picture but I love it:

20141229_185033.jpg

[Susann]

tcopitho's post and advice is right on I really only have a few small things to add.

My Milo is one who freaks out completely when carried if I try to hold/restrain him, and unless I keep him from seeing the ground moving right underneath him.
In other words, I have to let him lay on either my arm or my shoulder --shoulder works better because my body is keeping him from seeing the ground moving right under his face; if he's on my arm, I'll put my hand under his head to shield his view of the ground underneath.

I think the more you try to "hold" him in your hands, the more he'll feel restrained and claustrophobic --especially when moving. Once you've got him out of the tank and to whatever area you intend for your interaction, put him down by you or on you, and let him move around at his own convenience as much as possible, so he can learn to relax a bit. Like tcopitho said, putting down a few things he can crawl into/under, maybe even a towel or t-shirt in your lap, will probably help him relax quite a bit, and will let him relearn that being taken out of the tank isn't always about being restrained and afraid. And hopefully over time, with a lot of gentle patience on your part, he can learn that being outside the tank means good things happening: treats, food, and interesting things to explore.

I like to use a couch for these purposes; it's a smaller area where your presence can be fully felt by the skink and it's easy for you to keep the skink within reach, but still allows the skink some space to crawl off and over your lap to either find something interesting or something to hide under/behind.
When they start squeezing into areas where they might be hard to keep an eye on, or when they look like they might try to crawl off the edge, calmly pick them up and put them back on your lap and just let them go again; once they start to feel less stress and more curiosity, you'll notice a huge change in how they react to being picked up --it's the best feeling in the world when they no longer stiffen and fight being picked up, but instead seem to accept the handling.

If your skink is one who just darts off in any direction without regard of running off edges, maybe get someone to help you with blocking off his path, so that it'll be easier for you to stay calm and keep all motions around him slower.

Again, shorter sessions while he seems stressed out, but once he relaxes and gets into checking things out you can keep him out for longer periods.

If baths are stressful for him, I definitely suggest stopping them. If you feel you need to get dirt off of him before handling, maybe get a washcloth wet with warm water and just hold it while letting him crawl through it --he may even like being wrapped up in it for a while...

[stinky]

Hey Susan, thanks for the tips, I've tried a few and they're definitely helping. I adjusted my technique and now he seems a bit more relaxed when lifting him out of the enclosure. He ended up with another respiratory infection shortly after I made this thread, having to wrangle him for medicine really didn't help him relax around me. In due time I suppose x(