Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

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El Lobo
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby El Lobo » Tue Jul 30, 2013 4:59 pm

RoryBreaker wrote:
El Lobo wrote:The recurring theme here seems to be an attempt to power grow a young animal to produce the largest of the sub-species. This should be discouraged as it will invariably be deleterious to the well-being of the skink, almost certainly leading to a significantly shortened life span. External dimension may increase rapidly but major organs etc. will still develop according to genetic predisposition.

.


Power growing occurs naturally in wild reptiles , they call it "the boom and bust cycle". If good seasons occur back to back , year on year, the abundance of food available allows gorging. Long term in captivity, I agree it's not the best practice, but more food in the first 12 months is more beneficial than having too little.

As for making a big skink , it mainly comes down to luck, whether your skink is going to be a Michael Jordan or whether it's going to be a Danny devito.


I accept there can be a naturally occurring cycle with wild reptiles et al. I did note in a later post that I confine my observations to highland blotched, being the local sub-species. Because they are generally born so late in the season cycle they will go into their first brumation very soon after birth, emerging 5-6 months later looking almost exactly the way they looked when born. The wild examples always appear 1-2 years younger than those kept domestically and fed on a consistent diet without attempt to rapidly promote growth.
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby RoryBreaker » Tue Jul 30, 2013 5:08 pm

Alpine blotchies are a miracle that they even grow in the wild. With the young born very late and then they have to endure the onset of winter in short fashion. Simply an awesome effort.
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby Richard.C » Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:15 pm

Dakota Nivens wrote:That would go against people ID'ing an IJ, Merauke, Kei Island, Indonesian.. and saying that there is no proof that it is none of them. You go by characteristic, although all of them aren't textbook examples. :noknow:

I would go as far as saying that this is definitely a Halmahera Island Bluey, but not as far as saying it was collected on the island (there is no proof in saying so), but it shows all characteristic of the skinks that have been proven to be collected there.


you would go as far as saying its definatlu a halmahera island bluey but not as far as saying its collected from that island,lol

so in short u cant say with 100 percent certainty that it is infact a halmahera island bluetongue

dakota ij,meurake,kei islands and indos are alot easier to id,as they are subspecies ect,not locales of a certain subspecies,i didnt know you could willy nilly fly into halmahera,grab a bluey and fly back home again to a different country

your basing it off looks,now people have actually been there and surrounding areas to study them,its fact ones from elsewhere look the same,so if they dont occur on halmahera how on earth can they be called halmahera bluetongues,another fact is some from halmahera dont look like halmaheras,so are they not a halmahera based on not having these so called halmahera traits

halmaheras in captivity are based on a certain look,captivity does that,mother nature doesnt
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby Richard.C » Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:19 pm

riddle me this

what is this bluetongue?
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby gehtan » Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:21 pm

Susann wrote:
gehtan wrote:And since the Halmahera is not really a known species yet I just wanted to know if anybody knew some facts about them

I'm sure the Halmahera locale is fascinating, but it was sounding like he's having a hard time finding info on his species of BTS, and I'm just saying to read up on T. gigas gigas. If he THEN finds additional or different info for the Halmahera locale of T. gigas gigas, great, apply that. But no need to think he can't get facts on what his skink needs. :)


you said the exact things i feel. :)
thats why im kinda ignorant. Im so alienated to find Bloo as a skink not even on the main page of this site. Thats why im kinda want to search on different people and the size. hahahah :D
Hi call me Geh. :)
I own a Halmahera-Indo Blue tongue skink.
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby Bird_Brain » Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:26 pm

gehtan wrote:
Susann wrote:
gehtan wrote:And since the Halmahera is not really a known species yet I just wanted to know if anybody knew some facts about them

I'm sure the Halmahera locale is fascinating, but it was sounding like he's having a hard time finding info on his species of BTS, and I'm just saying to read up on T. gigas gigas. If he THEN finds additional or different info for the Halmahera locale of T. gigas gigas, great, apply that. But no need to think he can't get facts on what his skink needs. :)


you said the exact things i feel. :)
thats why im kinda ignorant. Im so alienated to find Bloo as a skink not even on the main page of this site. Thats why im kinda want to search on different people and the size. hahahah :D

He is located on the main page as T. g. gigas.
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby Dakota » Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:33 pm

Oh god-- that picture is hard to tell. :dead: ..but from what I can see, looks Merauke to me.. but I'd have to see an actual upload of the photo to confirm.

IJ is not a sub-species.. could just be a locale of the Merauke? :noknow:

The characteristics of the animals proven to be found on the island are quite visible and usually easy to tell. Geh's skink is showing all the characteristics of the animals that are found on the island.
Last edited by Dakota on Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby gehtan » Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:34 pm

Bird_Brain wrote:
gehtan wrote:
Susann wrote:I'm sure the Halmahera locale is fascinating, but it was sounding like he's having a hard time finding info on his species of BTS, and I'm just saying to read up on T. gigas gigas. If he THEN finds additional or different info for the Halmahera locale of T. gigas gigas, great, apply that. But no need to think he can't get facts on what his skink needs. :)


you said the exact things i feel. :)
thats why im kinda ignorant. Im so alienated to find Bloo as a skink not even on the main page of this site. Thats why im kinda want to search on different people and the size. hahahah :D

He is located on the main page as T. g. gigas.


Yeah, but I mean more focused or like a small tiny whiny piece of information or box just for halmaheras. :(
Hi call me Geh. :)
I own a Halmahera-Indo Blue tongue skink.
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby Richard.C » Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:39 pm

dakota the bluey bible on page 198 says that is a typical looking halmahera island gigas gigas,photo taken by a well known indo exporter
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby Bird_Brain » Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:43 pm

There are many different types of locales of the other species as well. The Aussie keepers can talk more about this but I have yet to recall reding anything different other than color and pattern between the different locales. Definitely don't recall any vast size or weight differences.

You are putting too much thought and care into the fact that its a "halmahera".
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby Dakota » Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:46 pm

You say some people have found them off the island, you say? Or did I misread your comment? :oops:

^ Is this recorded on the bluey bible that has been recorded by scientist, or a "he sad, she said" type situation?

---

I have seen some like that, Richard.. but couldn't quite put my finger on it. Halmahera Island is a decent sized island.. not all Meraukes look the same.. could be the evolution from Merauke to Halmahera.. or Indo to dark locale.. Who knows? :D

Btw-- I'm loving this conversation. :mrgreen:
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby Dakota » Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:52 pm

Here is another one like so, Richard.
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby Dakota » Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:55 pm

Here is an Axanthic, which I am friends with someone that has two collected from the island. Just looks like a more silver version to Geh's. But a more Silver AND black version to what you posted
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby gehtan » Tue Jul 30, 2013 6:58 pm

Bird_Brain wrote:There are many different types of locales of the other species as well. The Aussie keepers can talk more about this but I have yet to recall reding anything different other than color and pattern between the different locales. Definitely don't recall any vast size or weight differences.

You are putting too much thought and care into the fact that its a "halmahera".


Sorry, but I was finding a very very hard time on knowing its kind. Even the seller cant tell what it is specifically.
Dakota was the one who introduced to me the Halms. THANKS BRO! :D
I just want more information concerning the halms so i can understand it more and care for it. If you said look on the Indo page i think its too general for me.
At first the Indo page was not that convincing because it did not even really label one, so how would I know?
Im just a pet owner that cares for his rather "not-really known" pet. :)
Hi call me Geh. :)
I own a Halmahera-Indo Blue tongue skink.
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby Richard.C » Tue Jul 30, 2013 7:01 pm

ghes skink is also showing all the traits of animals not found on that island

halmahera is used as a name in captivity to describe a certain looking gigas gigas that has shown to infact also not onlu come from there and also shown to not be a 100 percent look of all the gigas gigas found on that island

your only hearing what you want to hear

look at wild studies,dont just go off captivity pics,captivity likes to give stupid names based off a look as apposed to what mother nature produces

the man whom described the merauke as a subspecies studied the various forms,went there,studied wild types and museum specimens,dr glen shea,not hear say,actual studied the animals,from lots of localities,yes its in the bluey bible,he has more extensive research papers elsewhere to

also meraukes are found in the south,gigas gigas are in the north so i highly doubt halmaheras have been infiltrated by merauke blood on halmahera

in captivity though thats always a possability
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby Richard.C » Tue Jul 30, 2013 7:07 pm

ghe,BRO,your skink is a tiliqua gigas gigas,the indonesion bluetongue skink,thats what you should be looking at for info pertaining to it,halmahera is just a part of there distribution,doesnt matter if its from there,a neighbouring island or 500 miles away,its an indo and info pertaining to indos covers suprise suprise ,indos which os what halmahera ones are

there care is similar as they are all the same thing,indonesian bluetongues,tiliqua gigas gigas
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby Dakota » Tue Jul 30, 2013 7:08 pm

On the main-page, it has Mainland Indo's and Halm's together, not really telling the difference between the two. Just look for the ones with the huge black stripe down the neck, or silver and black form which is indeed a Halmahera Island bluey, also.

Okay, look at the Axanthic, for example. What does it look like more.. what one you posted? ..or Geh's? Axanthic's are definitely on Halmahera, but some Axanthics have made it onto the mainland, and bred with the Mainland Indo's. Maya, a breeder of the Northern, Merauke, IJ, and soon the Axanthic in Malaysia.. knows exactly where her pair was collected.. and it was Halmahera Island.
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby Dakota » Tue Jul 30, 2013 7:13 pm

What about the whole-saler that imported hundreds of farmed babies from gravid females caught from the wild on Halmahera? Are they lying about that, too?
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby Richard.C » Tue Jul 30, 2013 7:17 pm

:kw: :kw:

you just said they are on the mainland to,mainland isnt halmahera

how does maya know where they were collected just out of curiosity
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Re: Is there a good growth chart out there for BTS?

Postby Dakota » Tue Jul 30, 2013 7:20 pm

Yeah, there are mainland Axanthics not as black as the island forms..

She had them exported from the Island.
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