Flowers

[saisaac]

I have read in several places that a significant portion of a wild BTS diet is made up of flowers. Does anyone know what flowers are good to feed them? My beardie used to love munching on petunias. Only the white, yellow and pink ones she always rejected the purple ones.

[Katrina]

I didn't include flowers in the diet chart because I've never seen any evidence that they would be more than an occasional treat. Can you link what you've read? I'd be curious to see it!

As far as edible flowers - I've fed nasturtiums, dandelion, pansies, etc. Dandelion is great. I haven't found that my blueys eat flowers with much enthusiasm so I haven't ever fed them other than when I have them on hand anyway.

[Spindown]

I personally love Daisys...I would not be sure what is safe for people is safe for reptiles though, so you'd have to research?

[Linnea]

i feed dandelions (leaves included) and some other things here that are pet safe to offer, but i cant say my blueys really enjoy them. one taste and then they spit them out.

id also like to learn if they eat other flowers in aus and indonesia, and if so which ones always fun to try to find exotic plants.

[Lea]

I've seen a few eat flowers in the wild, in SA, but it's often when times are hard and the environment in sparse in fruits. I would say, as far as energy content goes, gram for gram, that the energy content of fruits would be a lot higher than the less palatable flowers available, making it a more efficient food source for the hungry lizard. It's supposition, and just a theory, but instinct may help them dictate which to go for when both are offered, hence why they often decline them in a captive environment.

Mine do seem to actually enjoy a few of the herbaceous plants though and will Hoover up mint, basil and some succulent plants, regardless of what else they are offered.

[saisaac]

"Because of high ecological, morphological, and species diversity, skinks diets range from insects to plants...The largest skunks, including the tree skinks of the Solomon Islands (Corucia) and the Australian blue-tongues (Tiliqua), have shifted to eating fruits and flowers, although insects are still taken." page 49 of Lizards: Windows to the Evolution of Diversity by Pianka and Vitt. Later in the book they also talk about their strong jaws that are capable of crushing snails and beetles.

"Shingle-back lizards are primarily herbivorous living on a diet of flowers, berries and succulent leaves, however they will opportunistically consume insects and carrion." This quote comes from the Australia Zoo website.

"Foods: in wild: insects, snails, carrion & wildflowers, native fruits & berries" this comes from Bolling Green State University.

"The skinks diet consists of both plant and animal material, including flowers, fruits foliage, snails, crickets and eggs." FourthCrossingWildlife.com

"Blue tongue skinks are easy to accommodate as they are omnivorous and eat a plethora of food items including, but not limited to: fruits (bananas are a favorite, but they also enjoy peaches, mangos, papayas and sliced apples) and berries, flowers (hibiscus is a good choice), leafy greens, snails, slugs, earthworms, crickets, grasshoppers, locust, and carrion. In their native lands they have a reputation for stealing dog food..." Sandfire Dragon Ranch.

[saisaac]

So LeaBilly, you think they eat flowers primarily because they are more available? Do we have any reason to believe that they should be offered on captivity? In other words, might flowers provide another level of necessary diversity to their captive and native diets?

[Lea]

That's interesting to read! I feed my shinglebacks less meat than the Easterns, mostly for the reasons that they are primarily vegetarian in their wild diet. They still have 30 - 50 percent meat, far more than the wild, but I don't have good feeder insects here year around (poor suppliers, so my personal preference not to feed due to lack of quality). I have a few good mealworms at certain times, but increase the protein side with a little more meat than they would naturally.

Being a little spoilt in Australia, I'm lucky to be able to offer choices from their natural environment. I would be more cautious in your situation, but I'd still consider them for treats, more than a regular food. As a consideration, most plants would be eaten in smaller quantities than what we would offer. For example, we might give three or four food choices in one meal, whereas in the wild they may have a few nibbles here and there, depending on A, what is available and B, what they can reach! A few leaves on the bottom of a bush may give enough for them to move to a different plant, maybe not of the same species.

My point here is, that there is little known about the toxic effects of wild plants and berries on our lizards and while they may eat them in small quantities, they can still be poisonous if taken in larger volumes as they will exceed the renal threshold or capacity, after which, the effects could be enough to cause the animal harm, or even be fatal.

They would be my main concerns. So as Kat, said, a little offering as a one off or occasional treat, is unlikely to cause harm and could possibly be offering good nutritional benefits by way of their high vitamin or antioxidant levels.

[Katrina]

Thanks for the references. I'm not sure that flowers would make up a 'significant' portion of the diet, but I'm sure the Australian members would have a much better idea.

As far as native diet - I think we know quite a bit of what they will eat, but that generally includes anything on ground level that is edible. Scott knows quite a lot about native plants and did have an outdoor enclosure with lots of native plants so they could munch on the flowers and berries (but still fed a traditional, dog food based diet). Discussions about providing a closer native diet don't really go anywhere generally because we don't know well enough what they eat exactly in the wild and it isn't something that can be provided realistically in captivity. If you look at the native diet in the bluey bible or from what people on here know, it doesn't seem balanced in calcium and phosphorus, but you don't see any wild blueys that have MBD type issues.

My take on this is that as much variety as you can offer in veggies, greens, flowers etc is great. If you have the means and desire to provide lots of edible flowers, then that is great. But I wouldn't think that flowers would make up a 'significant' portion of the wild diet except for the certain areas at certain times of year when plants are flowering and assuming nothing else more palatable is available then. And for providing 'necessary' diversity to their captive diet - too many blueys have lived long lives and bred successfully on a diet of chiefly canned dog food to assume that flowers or a more natural diet would be necessary.

Thanks for the references. I haven't read much about flowers being a large part of the diet in scientific literature but from what I have read it seems that they are hungry, opportunistic feeders.

[Spindown]

I'm not surprised honestly that they spit out dandelions...they seem to have similar taste preferences to us (liking certain fruits, etc), and I accidentally tasted dandelions once...and ONLY once X_X
Daisies taste like buttery carrots.

I also agree with treats vs regular diet, but thats just me

[Scotts1au]

I think to understand shinglebacks it helps to look at their natural environment, generally very summer dry Mediterranean climate, often very sparse vegetation. Opportunities to rummage around finding grubs etc are limited, so it is a matter of Being able to survive on what is on offer or die. Tiliqua are known for their ability to tolerate toxins in plants, particularly substances such as monoflouroacetate (1080) and the proliference of asteracea in their environment infers their capacity to deal with naturally occurring substances like pyrethrins.

I have trialled a number of species, but I'm not sure how many flowers have actually been eaten because most of the flowers tend to occur at the wrong times of year here. They definitely do chow down on the fruits of many native plants that I could list. That being said I have seen them eating flowers off native lilies (Dianella species)

[saisaac]

Glad to get some feed back. I am certainly not advocating making flowers a significant portion of a captive diet but just wondering if would be a good idea to offer them occasionally to diversify their diet. I think I will look into planting a few edible flowers when we plant our gardens this year and see if my skink likes to munch on a few every now and again. If he doesn't eat them, oh well we give him a varied diet none the less. I've been searching for some snails in our area to give him a nice treat sometime, but they seem impossible to find around here.

[Lea]

Not as a flowers, but as a fruit, the strawberry plant is easy to grow and fairly prolific, so would be a good starter choice for a pick their own type of plant. Herbs such as mint, basil and a common thyme, have nutritious green leaves with a fairly good calcium content gram for gram to other green veggies. It may not be eaten in big quantities by your skink, but used more as a grazer food, to pick at when they feel like a taste challenge or even used as a palette cleanser, kind of how we might use a mouth rinse. I'm not sure that they think it through the same way, but I see it as I view why cats eat grass, like a natural detox, animal style!

There are some great succulents with high water contents, such as aloe Vera, which I have seen munched, again by the shinglebacks. Some of the Australian natives of course would be highly appropriate, but I think they would be tough to come by in the US. You may want to ask someone like Jeff, in Arizona, about some of the desert species that could be available in your state also. If you do a little research into the species native to the locale of your skink in the wild, you might find you can match with a similar species of plant in your location.

[saisaac]

Thanks for the great advice. Illinois has a pretty good climate for growing a variety of plants. We have a large herb garden every year with plenty of mint, sage, basil, etc. My wife was thinking about planting a few varieties of berries so I'll push for adding some strawberries to the bunch. She has grown hibiscus in the past and then brought the plants inside for winter. If I recall correctly only the flowers are edible.

One of my favorite aspects of caring for a blue tongue skink so far has to be feeding him a wide variety of foods. His favorites sk far seem to be blueberries, egg, and squash. I still have to mix the greener vegetables into the mix well or he just avoids them.