BLUE TONGUE SKINKS

Ok, so a little while back I opened a thread a few weeks back explaining that one of my blueys toe ends fell off a few days after shedding. I have been checking and checking his toes and there was one more which strook me, which did look constricted and had the same result as the other toe around a week and a half ago. I tried to help him by soaking him and trying to rub it a good while beforehand and tried persistently, but he wouldnt let me touch it at all and just kept flinching and kicking. I also gently applied olive oil too as suggested by Katrina, but again, he wouldnt let me rub it for the shed to come off. I've been making checks every 2-3 days as i usually would and everything seemed fine. Until today. I took him out for his checks and another toe looks extremely bad, so much so that i think the entire toe is going to drop. Another toe on his front foot looks bad also, and he wont let me touch either of them. I've been doing my best to try and help him but he just wont let me.

When he was shedding, he did seem to struggle, as after 2-3 days I had to soak him to get id say around 40-50% of his remaining shed off. It did come off very easy, but still had to have my help to do so. I did check his toes, over and over, and peeled shed off of them, so I also thought then that the shed on his toes had came off.

I do think this is related to the humidity in his enclosure, as the substrate he is on is very dry (beech chips) and making his belly scales dry and a little crispy. I've been planning on getting him some new substrate but was waiting for the store near me to get some hemp substrate in, as i would of liked to of tried it as there is absolutely no risk of impaction with it, however I think it needs to be changed urgently, and was thinking about going with cypress mulch. To be more specific - the exo terra jungle earth - http://www.surreypetsupplies.co.uk/exo- ... 26.4l.html

Would this be a good substrate? Will it hold moisture? Will there be more humidity? Has anybody got any experience with it?

Being that it is easter weekend, I obviously wont be able to obtain anything until tuesday.

Features

- Ceramic Heater
- Temps around 35 C basking spot
32 constant hot end
25 - 27 at cool end depending on temperature of the room
- Beech Chips substrate
- Enclosure size 4ft x 2ft by 1.7ft high.
- Exo Terra Hagen Resin water bowl (Large)
- Giant Habba hut
- Repti-glo 10.0 42" UVB tube
- Nutrobal supplement

I really dont want to come across as a neglectful owner, as I am taking the best care I can of my skink. The substrate wasnt my first choice, but it is what he has been kept on since he was born, and has had no previous issues with it, so naturally i went with it.

If somebody could please give me just some opinions as to what they think, and about the suggested substrate etc. It might be worthwhile noting he is and IJ and this is the first shed he has gone through since he has been in my care.

Any feedback is greatly, greatly appreciated as I really want my skink to be as healthy as possible.

I will upload some pictures tomorrow too when i can get some sunlight in, as the lighting at the minute will not allow for a clear shot.

Sorry to hear about the issues you're having. This seems to be an all-too common occurrence with many of the indo species these days.

I don't have any experience with this issue so I can't help you much there, except to say that you may want to consider a vet visit. The folks on this forum can only make guesses based on what you tell us, because we can't see it first-hand. It would probably help you to have a vet look at it and give you his/her two cents on it.

As for bedding- I use cypress mulch and LOVE it. Sometimes I mix it with a little bit of aspen chips just to sort of make it "fluffier" but for keeping up humidity and curing dry belly scales there is nothing better IMO!

cypress mulch is a good choice, also peat and a little sand mix. (just be sure to never feed in cage so not to cause impaction) these will both hold moisture. cypress is very popular with tegu's since they need to keep high humidity levels, so this or the other option work. Using spagnum or sheet moss in the enclosure (esp filling a hide with one) and making sure it stays a little damp. spraying the cage with mist once or twice a day while shedding or having these problems will help too. also putting on VERY hot water in the shower and closing the door then sitting in the room with the lizard while it gets very warm and humid in there will help loosen the skin a little too, id do this right before giving him a good long soak for 20 minutes in very warm (without being too hot) water to help loosen the skin.then try to rub the shed off as well as using the olive oil around that time too.

i agree with visiting the vet though as well and i'd do all the things i said to try to give him a lot of humidity to get the skin loose.

Oh id also get an extra, smaller water dish and put it right under the basking area so it will evaporate and create humidity.

Larissa - in your 4 months experience with your bluey, have you ever dealt with toe loss?

No, I haven't. I'm just thinking that humidity and warm water might help skin not to get so stuck. Am I saying complete nonsense or something? Sorry

Also, I don't see how cypress mulch would be a bad option for substrate...or well how anything I said would do any bad. It might not do wonders but I think it could help at least just a little. Just trying to give "helpful" ideas...

LarissaLurid wrote:No, I haven't. I'm just thinking that humidity and warm water might help skin not to get so stuck. Am I saying complete nonsense or something? Sorry

Also, I don't see how cypress mulch would be a bad option for substrate...or well how anything I said would do any bad. It might not do wonders but I think it could help at least just a little. Just trying to give "helpful" ideas...

No, I was just curious because the way you post seems like you have much more experience than 4 months. It comes off as fact rather than helpful guess, so I was just wondering if I was missing something or maybe this wasn't your first bluey.

Cypress is great, but unfortunately keeping the humidity up doesn't really seem to help in some cases. It seems like some loose toes for almost no reason, generally they are ALWAYS Indonesian species. If toes are falling off, there is a chance of infection so I'd switch to paper towel and try to keep it absolutely clean so there is no chance of infection traveling to the blood. Its really odd, sometimes it seems to happen no matter what, there is an article that I link in the Advanced section and fungal problems and toe loss which might be worth looking into.

I'm not sure it is really stuck shed, I think it is a different problem. Stuck shed is easy to get off, toe loss that happens despite all effort to remove shed and provide good husbandry seems like more than just that. I'd also recommend the vet and maybe mention that fungal article to see if the vet might agree.

Katrina wrote:

LarissaLurid wrote:No, I haven't. I'm just thinking that humidity and warm water might help skin not to get so stuck. Am I saying complete nonsense or something? Sorry

Also, I don't see how cypress mulch would be a bad option for substrate...or well how anything I said would do any bad. It might not do wonders but I think it could help at least just a little. Just trying to give "helpful" ideas...

No, I was just curious because the way you post seems like you have much more experience than 4 months. It comes off as fact rather than helpful guess, so I was just wondering if I was missing something or maybe this wasn't your first bluey.

Cypress is great, but unfortunately keeping the humidity up doesn't really seem to help in some cases. It seems like some loose toes for almost no reason, generally they are ALWAYS Indonesian species. If toes are falling off, there is a chance of infection so I'd switch to paper towel and try to keep it absolutely clean so there is no chance of infection traveling to the blood. Its really odd, sometimes it seems to happen no matter what, there is an article that I link in the Advanced section and fungal problems and toe loss which might be worth looking into.

I'm not sure it is really stuck shed, I think it is a different problem. Stuck shed is easy to get off, toe loss that happens despite all effort to remove shed and provide good husbandry seems like more than just that. I'd also recommend the vet and maybe mention that fungal article to see if the vet might agree.

OH thank you then! I felt bad for a minute like I said something wrong!! No my bluey has all his toes, but I spend ALL my time researching non-stop to find out everything about so many types of animals, but most especially the ones I have as pets so I can make sure to prevent bad things, like toe loss, or know what to do if something happens. I have a lifetime of experience with various types of animals, so I try to connect my knowledge and use it for other things as well.

Anyway, yea I think cypress mixed with peat like im planning on changing my substrate to might be a good option, I feel like this would hold more of the moisture and be nice to dig in.

Hopefully it's something that a vet can help with. I don't want your (to owner of the one we are talking about) little guy loosing any more toes, I'd probably freak out and feel so bad if that happened with mine. Good luck :/

LarissaLurid wrote:OH thank you then! I felt bad for a minute like I said something wrong!! No my bluey has all his toes, but I spend ALL my time researching non-stop to find out everything about so many types of animals, but most especially the ones I have as pets so I can make sure to prevent bad things, like toe loss, or know what to do if something happens. I have a lifetime of experience with various types of animals, so I try to connect my knowledge and use it for other things as well.

I really didn't intend to make you feel bad, I was just wondering because you seemed to post with a lot more authority / experience than 4 months.

I really wish I knew what caused this toe loss. I have 3 that have almost no toes left, all of them had the issues long before I got them. I posted some about it here (although I think I showed the OP this already): viewtopic.php?f=19&t=17987

Emu oil works well in my experience, as well as lukewarm, shallow baths with epsom salts. The BTS in the thread I linked hasn't lost anymore toes since I acquired him, so it seems to be working.

Thanks for the reply guys, Its very much appreciated and this is a great community with lots of helpful people. Unfortunately being in the UK though theres a time difference as to when people are posting on here. Anyway, being only 16 and having no means of transport or money means im limited to only asking my parents what we can do about it. I think were going to get him in somewhere though as they can see my concerns.

Unfortunately, i couldnt get any pictures today as i lost my camera, but then found it with a dead battery so will get some pictures up tomorrow. I've gone ahead and bought some cypress mulch, even if the problem isnt related to husbandry so that those dry belly scales will be no more after his next shed, which, surprisingly should be coming up in the next couple of weeks considering its already been 4 weeks since he last shed

However, reading that article that katrina posted, i stumbled upon and found a reply stating,
"it should have taken a lot more time than just 2 days. Generally it takes several bad sheds going untouched before the old skin is tight enough to cut off circulation." - This concerned me because his toes were perfectly fine when i got him and hes only shed just the once so again, as suggested could not be husbandry/shed related, but that of an infection.

As for the paper towels, are these just regular kitchen paper rolls? do you lay them flat or shred them up or what, cause my skink is PERMANENTLY digging around messing his substrate up, so i feel if they were supposed to be flat, then he would just be playing in the bottom of his wooden enclosure

Im also going to, as well as aranging for him to see a vet, going to go back to the pet shop i bought him from, to see if the guy has had any similar problems, as he has been breeding the skinks in store for a few years. It would be interesting to see what he makes of it too as he, although a pet shop employee, was quite knowledgable and tells me hes kept reptiles for years. Gives me a chance to go see the huge blood python in there too after seeing photos on here of josh's from the last few days which have teased me.

Thanks for the ongoing support from everybody on here, you guys are amazing and just hope you can appreciate what i can do personally to get help for my skink.

Thanks for the article too Katrina, It was very helpful and proved for an interesting read.