Page 1 of 2

Wax and Pheonix Worm Colonies

Posted: Tue Nov 13, 2007 10:01 pm
by Fatal_S
I bought 100 of each wax and pheonix worms yesterday as a start for colonies of feeder insects. I posted some of my info in another thread, so I'll just quote it to here.

Fatal_S wrote:The pheonix worms should be fairly easy to maintain and breed. I can also feed them the skink food that's gone bad, or my family's waste food. Tommorow (later today) I will be setting up the worm habitats, and afterwards I can make a post about what I'm doing, etc.

For now, if you'd like:
http://www.windward.org/notes/notes66/walt66-7.htm
This site is great, but the site it links to:
http://www.esrla.com/brazil/frame.htm
Is amazing for information. I got most of my info from these sites.
Another site:
http://www.cals.ncsu.edu/waste_mgt/smit ... les/A2.pdf


Fatal_S wrote:Okay, well i'm bored, so I drew up what I'm hoping to use as a setup:
Image
Definately not my best drawing, but it works.
Explaination:
The plan is to buy a plastic bin maybe 2' x 1' for now, then upgrade if the colony actually grows.
Above the bin, in blue, we see a light. This is a CME I just removed from Wocket's tank because it's too weak. I'm hoping the heat will jump start the colony, and once it's going I can slow it down anytime by providing less heat/food.
Food will be scraps and waste foods from my family and any skink food that goes bad. In this drawing the food is the scribbles drawn in pencil. You can see the food coming through the top, and into where the larva (black dots) are. Yumm.
The food goes through a funnel (may not be added, depends on if it's needed), the purpose of which is solely to keep the loose flies from escaping. But if some do, meh, they're harmless so I'll just catch them and feed them to Fang or my next spider... or my dog.
The green thing on top is the lid. On the left side under the lid is a layer of black, which will be cloth or fly netting or something to keep the flies in when I open the lid.
At the bottom of the tub on the left side is a blue ramp leading to a ledge. This is where the larva ready to pupate will go to pupate. They do this naturally, so no worries for me. And once every few weeks or so I'll just wipe whatever's gathered on there (pupate shells, dead flies, etc) and wipe it back into the food.
Above the ramp, in green, is a series of egg carton pieces or the like attatched to the bin where the flies can lay eggs and rest. The eggs hatch, the hatched larva then search for the food, and fall down back to the bottom. Then it starts again.
As for water, the food may contain enough moisture, or I may mist occasionally if they seem dehyrated.
Hopefully this will be a self sustaining colony that I just feed, and leave. I can collect worms by simply scooping them up, picking them out of the food, and throwing the food back. If I use the funnel I'll just have to remove it first. For the small version I may just have a layer of fly mesh over the whole top, and i'll just open it enough to stick the food in or get worms out. Once I get it set up I'll post about it, and we'll see if it works.


So today I went to my local Dollarama and bought supplies for the bins. I spent a total of $6.43 ^.^ I bought 2 bins, a set of 2 mesh placemats for lids, some wax paper, some thick poster paper, and some duct tape.

For the wax worms, I made up a mixture of oatmeal and honey and put it on the bottom of the bin. I then added crumpled wax paper to be used for laying eggs, and tossed in the worms. The placemat was partly duct taped on top as a screen. Result:
Image
Image

The pheonix worms required a bit more work to set up, but still very easy. I first built a box out of the poster paper and duct tape, and added a ramp with an incline of under 45*. I then cut several thin strips of poster paper, and made egg areas by folding one strip like a fan, then taping it to the other strips to make alcoves. I then taped this to the wall of the bin, with one on each side. I put the placemat over, then put some of the older food in my fridge in, followed by the worms.
Image
Image
Image

After this I took the tanks to my room and set them up under a heat lamp. Here they will live and hopefully breed and produce many nummy wormlings for my skinks.
Image
Image
Image

Posted: Tue Nov 13, 2007 10:26 pm
by NomadOfTheHills
Phoneix worms and waxworms are soo tiny, your gonna go through a lot feeding 4 blueies!

Posted: Tue Nov 13, 2007 10:37 pm
by Fatal_S
Lol, ya, they are pretty small, but they wont be my only feeders. I also plan to get some snail, roach, and other worm colonies going later on. Also, I only have 3 BTS right now, though that will change next baby season.

Posted: Tue Nov 13, 2007 10:44 pm
by Steve
I want to figure out how to integrate both phoenix worms and red wigglers into one vermicomposting bin... see if the red wigglers can further break down what the phoenix worms leave behind...

Posted: Tue Nov 13, 2007 11:15 pm
by Fatal_S
You can't put them together, the pheonix worms will eat any other critter in the bin. The give off a chemical that tells other flies not to lay eggs there because the eggs will be eaten. I don't think they'd eat the live wigglers, but the eggs would be fair game. Taking the waste from the PWs and putting it into a wiggler tank could work though.

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 12:40 am
by Steve
Well I was thinking that, or possibly a multilayer system of some sort.....

anyway, very neat setup you've got, it definitely has inspired me.

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 12:51 am
by Fatal_S
Thank you muchly ^.^ If you want the pictures e-mailed still, I can do it tomorrow during the day. My picture computer is upstairs, so I can't do it right now. I really hope these worms end up making babies. Only time will tell.

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 7:28 am
by Leigh
That looks like a relatively easy way to get started mate, I'd be a little concerned about the ceramic lamp softening or melting the placemat lids, there's under floor heating from your set up below, seeing as its at the basking end.

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 8:49 am
by Fatal_S
Leigh wrote:That looks like a relatively easy way to get started mate, I'd be a little concerned about the ceramic lamp softening or melting the placemat lids, there's under floor heating from your set up below, seeing as its at the basking end.


Ya, I was somewhat paranoid about the melting or burning of the lids. I watched for several hours last night, and I don't know what the lids are made of, but the small amount of heat doesn't seem to affect them. And yep, Wocket's tank underneath does provide some heat, but I wanted the extra to bring the temp up more. I'd say it's now pleasantly warm in the bins. Next time I get paid I'll look into replacing the lids with fly screen.

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 9:58 am
by Steve
If you're still willing to share, then yes please do send the pictures over still. I really do love the detail that went into setting this up.

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 11:25 am
by Marie
I have a thriving roach colony (B. dubia). Although they give me the heebie jeebies, they are super easy to maintain, and the reptiles love them. :hurl: If you decide to get into those, let me know. I have a detailed dubia caresheet, complete with pictures.

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 12:00 pm
by Steve
Which one of us are you talking to?

I know I'd love to see that caresheet as well!

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 1:48 pm
by Fatal_S
As soon as I get some money again I'd love to start a roach colony. Which ones are B. Bubia? As in what are they like and do they climb glass/fly? I did a lot of roach research several months ago, and they seem neat to breed. I'd love to see the caresheet too.

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 2:43 pm
by Marie
Blaptica dubia are from South America and like warm, tropical environments (so theoretically if they escape in WI, they won't live long). They cannot climb smooth plastic and do not fly. With that said, the males do have wings, and they hover occasionally, so I have a top on mine. What's really cool is that these buggers have live young. No eggs to hatch. My crested gecko breeder got me into this roach breeding hobby, and she wrote a five page caresheet for the roaches. If anybody would like it, PM me your e-mail address.

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:07 pm
by NomadOfTheHills
I would love a copy, nomadofthehills@gmail.com.

I'm currently breeding madagsgar hissers, but they take soo long to mature.

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:19 pm
by Hijinks
Wow, awesome! Good luck with this project! How do your skinks like the phoenix worms? Mine ate a few at first, then seemed to decide that they weren't worth the effort. I had to hide them...in his delicious veggies. :ohyes:

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:40 pm
by Fatal_S
Pryce honestly doesn't seem to notice that worms exist. I guess they're just too small. He does however eat them by accident when they're in his food dish, and he never notices.

Wocket it usually a worm pig, but when I fed him 2 days ago, he was more interested in the chunks of chicken. Trikks on the other hand gobbles any wiggling thing, so I mixed the worms with the food and got him to actually eat a small amount of chicken/veggies!! Big accomplishment.

I only fed a couple worms the one time, as I need as many as possible to breed. Once I get more though, I'll give them several, and see how they like it. Im sure Fang's gonna go batty over any flies or moths I feed her though. The colonies will be worth it just to be able to feed fang during the winter, even if the skinks ignore the worms. Plus I think the wax worms are cute.

Posted: Wed Nov 14, 2007 5:19 pm
by Tattoo
Worm Woman runs amuck ... Film at eleven. :lol:

Fatal I would be scared to come to your house with all the creepy crawlers you have around. Ewwww !!!

Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 1:49 am
by Leigh
You could even start selling them on if you get over ly successfull with the breeding program.

Posted: Thu Nov 15, 2007 2:34 am
by Fatal_S
As an add on to my Pheonix Worm information about the set up, I've found a small flaw. The box with the ramp I installed is close to useless in this small enclosure. The worms that are ready to pupate simply need clear floor space, which is about half of the bin. They also can't seem to find the ramp, or don't want to, so they're staying on the ground.

I think one problem may be that the worms tend to move around the edge of the bin, whereas the ramp is in the middle. A ramp that led from the sides of the bin, so the searching worms were automatically directed upwards, would be better. An upturned bowl with unsteep sides could also work well. For now though, the worms seem content to pupate on the un-fooded side of the bin. Good for them.

And yes, some of the worms do seem to be ready to pupate. They're dark colored and have left the food side. I hope they manage to pupate and I get some flies soon. Just my good fortune that some of the worms were already mature I guess.