Lighting questions (UV) MVB vs linear bulbs

[Buddy]

I use MVB bulbs atm för my BTS, Zoo med's powersun or Mega-Ray's Solar raptor, only problem is that these work fine during the colder parts of the year, but in the summer they don't. Since they only come in 100w, 125w and 160w my basking spot gets too hot. So I was thinking about Exo terra's linear Repti Glo bulbs, I already have a fixture in my tank. The 10.0 40" bulb is said to be effective up to 20", my tank is 22" from fixture to ground. Will this work? Also I'm not sure if 10.0 is needed, maybe 5.0 is enough?

I'm a little sceptical to these bulbs, I like the MVB bulbs since they get their uv when they're basking, but is it more benefitial with linear bulbs that cover most of the space in the tank? Pros and cons?

[Roarschak11]

What are the dimensions of the enclosure you keep him in, and what are the temps currently?

[donkeybuff]

Since BTS don't really need UVB with the proper supplementation, it really doesn't matter which type they get. The MVB is a more natural choice because like the sun, the blueys get their heat and UV at the same time in the same place. MVBs are also said to produce more UV than other types of bulbs. The only benefit of the strip bulb that I can see is that the cost of replacing them is lower than replacing MVBs.

[Tom]

Neither the 10.0 or the 5.0 put out much UV according to my Solarmeters. At 22 inches you won't get much benefit, other than nice full spectrum lighting. The "Solar Raptors" over here do not generate much heat and are available in 35, 50 and 70 watt sizes. I think one of those would give you the best UV with out too much heat in your taller enclosure.

According to everything that I have read and the experience of some long term keepers and breeders, BTSs can get all their D3 in their diet and don't "need" UV. I would throw up a regular incandescent flood bulb of whatever wattage works for your enclosure at various times of the year for basking and then use the long florescent tube for lighting up the enclosure.

[Buddy]

I've made the choice to provide uv light for my BTS, rather than supplementing with D3. My personal oppinion is that D3 through uv light is a more natural way to provide this, I know that the uv discussion goes on and on but this is the way I want to do it.

My tank is 6x2x2 feet.

I won't use the Exo terra bulbs then. About the solar raptors, I need the self-ballasted bulbs and I can't find them in lower wattage than 100?

[Buddy]

Basking spot is 100-103 degrees and the cold end is around 73 degrees.

[jdheff1982]

Don't worry too much about the UV. If the skink is getting it via a lamp or supplement, so be it. I use both as a redundancy system. If my UVB dies, my skink still gets his D3 via supplements and vice versa. I use a 75 watt halogen bulb + the Exo-Terra UVB200 as my heating and lighting. My cage dimensions are smaller, so the MVB's would be way over kill for my setup.

[donkeybuff]

Please don't rely solely on the UV light for D3! Even if you are providing UVB, you still need to supplement D3 because even the best bulbs are nowhere near as good as the sun.

[Richard.C]

Vitamin supplementation is of way more importance than uv light,supplemented ones with zero uv thrive with out uv lighting,ones with just uv and no supplementation are prone to mbd still,diet and dietry intake of supplements/vitamins and ninerals are the most important part of the process

Dont rely on uv lighting to supply that or it will generally end in dissapointment

[Tom]

Buddy, according to the readings on my Solarmeters, the self ballasted Solar Raptors do provide the best artificial UV compared to other products on the market right now. It seems like the lower wattage models might also suit your need for a lower amount of heat for summer time. I hope you can find the right one.

Having said that, please heed the warning of those more experienced than you or I. There have been many cases of BTSs under UV light that still ended up with MBD. Go ahead and provide all the artificial UV that you want, but please also supplement with some calcium and D3, just to be sure all your bases are covered. It won't hurt anything at all if your skink doesn't "need" it, but it could literally save his life if your UV plan doesn't work out as well as you hope it will. Cheap insurance, in other words.

To demonstrate that I follow my own advice, I live in a very warm climate and I have outdoor enclosures for my skinks to use during fair weather. They get hours of real sunshine all year long, several days a week, and sometimes all day every day, weather and time permitting. I STILL mix in some calcium with D3 into their varied diet, just to be on the safe side. If anyone could make a case that their skinks don't "need" D3 supplementation, I could, but I still do it "just in case..." I do this on the advice of people who have been keeping and breeding Blue Tongues for many years, and know far more about it than I do.

All the best,
Tom

[dsteamn]

I keep my blueys outside in the summer months as well. I was told not to supplement outside because too much calcium is bad for them. Now my breeder female has two small kinks in her tail. They are under halide or mercury vapor bulbs inside. I will always supplement from now on.

[hurricanejen]

In the summer, when I run into the same issue with high wattage lights being too much for my skinks, I swap down to a 50 watt basking and use 10.0 UVB bulbs (two of them, mounted on either side of the basking bulb, so when they bask they are also close to the UV lights). They can get about 12" away from the UV bulbs, and have done well for me that way.

You should always add supplemental calcium to the diet. When putting your skinks outdoors for 8 to 10 hours a day, switch to a type that does not have D3. If you are only putting them outdoors one or two days a week, it's usually best to continue to supplement with a calcium that has D3. You could, if you are worried, switch to the Repashy type of "low D" calcium/D3 supplement, which hopefully would provide enough D3 to prevent any metabolic issues, but not so much that if your skink is able to make its own with exposure to natural sunlight, you run into issues with too much.

http://www.lllreptile.com/store/catalog/reptile-supplies/vitamins-medicines-and-cage-cleaners/reptile-calcium-and-vitamins/-/repashy-supercal-lod-3oz-jar/

[Buddy]

I always supplement with calcium on each meal. I use zoo med's repti calcium and I have the one with D3 and the one without. I mostly use the one with D3 in periods when he doesn't bask as much and in winter time. Do you think I should supplement with D3 more often? Even though I use mvb bulbs? I don't want to overdo it.

[donkeybuff]

It's still safer to supplement D3 at all times, even when you are using an MVB. The risk of MBD is much higher than the risk of D3 overdose, as long as you don't go too crazy with the supplementation.

[kittymau]

This is interesting. I am new to keeping herps that need UVB so I'm still learning. I have a bearded dragon (no BTS just yet), and people in the bearded dragon forums always say, supplement calcium with NO D3 if you use an MVB. but for BTS, it's safest to always supplement with D3? Is this because BTS are different and probably don't benefit from or need UVB??

[donkeybuff]

No, the way it works is that UVB allows diurnal animals to synthesize or create vitamin D3. All animals that are active in the sunlight benefit from UVB. The reason we supplement D3 is that without the same amount of UVB that the sun provides, our reptiles can't make enough D3 by themselves, so we have to give it to them artificially. MVBs do make more UVB than coil and tube lights, which means that the animals would probably be okay without D3 supplementation, but it's not going to hurt if you provide D3 in moderation. Additionally, people forget to replace bulbs, it's not uncommon for bulbs to have varying UV readings that are impossible to check without a solarmeter. Basically, I would rather supplement D3 in moderation than run the risk of not enough D3.

[hurricanejen]

I am not the biggest fan of BD forums - they are fanatical in their love of their beardies, but they can give some truly awful advice.

Even with a MVB, you should ALWAYS use calcium w/D3 for animals housed primarily indoors. While a MVB does produce a ton more UVB than a linear bulb, it produces only a tiny fraction compared to the sun. A MVB does not produce enough heat and UVB for our pets to metabolize enough of the D3 on their own without additional supplementation - this is true for beardies AND blue tongues, as well as iguanas, chameleons, agamas, or any other diurnal, basking lizard.

To go along with what DonkeyBuff has said - I have seen dozens of people come in to our stores to get help for their metabolic lizard due to not providing enough D3 or UVB, but never have I encountered someone whose pet had too much. Some small chameleon species (especially live bearers), as well as small, tropical/nocturnal geckos and lizards, do not need as much D3 as other species, but I've never seen a beardie or similar sized lizard have an issue that could possibly maybe somehow be connected to too much D3 or calcium.

A light coating of calcium w/D3 for each insect feeding, and your beardie and future blue tongue will thrive.

-Jen

[Richard.C]

Ahh ,bearded dragon forums,i agree with jen on those,alot of crazy thoughts on those forums,lol,i still recall someone mentioning they use there bums to drink,lol

Definatly DONT rely on any uv lights to look after your animals calcium/vitamin D3 needs,as they wont,at best they may benefit a little from it,dietry intake is of way more benefit,alit of uv provided reptiles succumb to mbd because owners belive there uv lights are miracle lights

The amount of people that dont use uv lighting at all but supplement diet over decades with no issues shows how important dietry intake is

And the amount of cases of animals getting mbd with access to uv lighting also shiws how important dietry intake is

[kittymau]

Well dang! Now what do I do with this giant container of calcium with no D3?!

[Katrina]

Well dang! Now what do I do with this giant container of calcium with no D3?!

You don't need to always feed calcium with D3 - just rotate them.