First BTS, comfirm ID please

[Anderous]

hi, just got my first BTS today from a local pet shop, which is pretty good, ive gotton healthy reptiles from them before so, anyway. They told me it is about 6 to 7 months old already close to 18 inches. They didnt know what it was, and i think its an Indonesian but not completelly sure. Healthy and very tame already, all toes and tail intact, they assured me it was CB. so anyway, just showing off my new guy, or girl, if anyone thinks they know what it is for sure please let me know. oh, and i dont quite have a name for it yet, still deciding.





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[Anderous]

actually now i think its a Meruke looking at more pics, anyway

[WanderingChai]

I'm no expert at IDing, but I'm leaning towards Meruke.

[Anderous]

yeah, thats pretty cool, i have the "longest" of the Blue Tongues. im glad im getting a 75 gallon for him in August

[James Wilson]

Looks like an Irian Jaya at first glance, but I am leaning more toward Merauke faded BTS. I would also not trust anyone (especially a petstore) that told me that they had a cb (T. gigas), that could not tell me who produced it, or when it was produced. What I am trying to tell you is that it is more likely than not that that is not a cb animal.

[Linnea]

meruake is my guess also (ive studied the information sheet on this site a lot lately XD )

congrats on getting a bts 8D

[Jeff]

I think this is one of those skinks that is pretty hard to place under one single "label". Indos, meraukes, and IJ's all exist together in a few locations. Because of that, we see skinks that are the definition of each, as well as animals everywhere in between the 3 different "looks". The bands on this skink look IJ, while the back of it's neck and legs look merauke. At the same time, the spaces between the bands are not "clean", which would point to being an indo.

As far as i'm concerned, all three labels are just names people came up with to describe the different looks that some skinks from PNG and Indonesia have. At some point some scientific types decided that there was enough difference between Indos and meraukes to warrant separate sub-species designations, but they still can't agree whether or not IJ's are even the same species.

I agree with James that this is likely a WC skink, which means that it is probably something created by nature which makes it as "pure" as it can be. It is just hard to fit it under any of our existing man-made labels.

Of course another possibility is that it is the result of a dispicable reptile "farm" in Indonesia where they just throw as many random animals as they can catch into big pits and let everything breed with whatever it can catch.

[xxmonitorlizardxx]

Its a newer form meruake. And they don't all get 33inches most stay around 18-!2inches mine is 19inches he's tiny.

[James Wilson]

Actually the Meraukes can get quite large, but not 33 inches. I would venture to say if someone saw a 33 inch bts, they were probably looking at a monitor or a tegu. The longest skink I ever had or saw was a merauke female. She was 27 inches long from nose to tail tip. Any, that was not an estimate. I actually "taped" her. That being said the the gigas forms have much longer tails than the other BTS species, and she was still a couple inches shorter in snout to vent length than my male northern that measured 24 inchs in total length. As I have mentioned a few times in the past, my large female merauke was an impressive skink that actually was chosen to be the cover girl on my old bts article that Reptiles Magazine published in November of 2001. I was also very happy to get the centerfold with a couple of my female Northerns as well.

[xxmonitorlizardxx]

Where is she now? And how do you know its a female?

[Anderous]

I dont know if its a female, i dont think i said it was. I have "it" in a 40 gallon breeder right now. I didnt plan to get a skink until August, but the breeder who was gonna be at the show here cancelled so i had to look elswhere. I didnt expect to get a skink yesterday but it was just so cute and healthy looking i couldnt resist. And as i said its a pretty good pet shop, they breed their own snakes and geckos. They said they got it in February, soneone just brang it in, at around 6 inches. its now almost 18 inches and looks great. they had it in a 20 gallon so its loving the 40 right now and burrowing in the aspen. I do plan to get a larger cage in August, probablly a 75 gallon for it. anyway, whatever it is, and WC or not its a nice tame skink so, im happy with it.

[James Wilson]

back in 2004, I parted with my BTS collection to make room for some other projects Rosy boas and insular island chuckwallas. I do not remember who got her. She had a complete lack of hemipenal bulging (even during the breeding season) she also never dropped a seminal plug, and her behavior when involved in test introductions with other males during the breeding season also confirmed this. I wanted so badly to breed her, but I had no male merauke to breed her with, only a male gigas gigas, and he was very small and very old. Back in 2000, T. gigas gigas was very hard to find, and T. gigas evanesence was even harder to find. I knew a local guy that had a large stunning merauke male, but he would not allow a breeding loan. And unfortunately, I would have never allow my female to go to him as he had close to 200 reptiles in his "care" and he kept his animals horribly. He had animals die on a daily basis, and I would never put my girl in that kind of situation. So the closest to breeding that she got was testing out my unsexed acquisitions to find out what sex they were. Introductions with her confirmed the sex of many of my animals with 100% accuracy.

[Katrina]

Exactly what Jeff and James said - looks full grown, definitely not 6 months old. Wouldn't trust that it is CB. Subspecies is at best a guess / arbitrary label just like Jeff said.

[Anderous]

just curious, why do you think it is a wild caught skink. are their any specific things that point to it being wild caught other than i got it from a pet shop? I am going to go over to the shop tomorrow to do some more quizzing on where and when they got this skink, i really want to know if they were lying to me.
So if there are any questions you guys think i should ask to get an idea, let me know. also, am i wrong, how big are they when born, it was 6 inches according to them when they got it. assuming that is the truth, how old would that make the skink?

[Anderous]

oh, and they said they got it in February, i forgot to mention, february at 6 inches

[Katrina]

just curious, why do you think it is a wild caught skink. are their any specific things that point to it being wild caught other than i got it from a pet shop? I am going to go over to the shop tomorrow to do some more quizzing on where and when they got this skink, i really want to know if they were lying to me.
So if there are any questions you guys think i should ask to get an idea, let me know. also, am i wrong, how big are they when born, it was 6 inches according to them when they got it. assuming that is the truth, how old would that make the skink?

T. gigas spp. are very rarely captive born and bred - they are typically WC imports or else captive born to a WC mother (who was gravid when imported). Pet stores are all about making money (like any successful business) and WC is cheaper than CBB, so that is what they typically stock. Because it is an Indonesian species and being sold at a pet store it is very likely to be WC or captive born (but not captive bred).

If it is 18 inches long it is likely quite a bit older than 6-7 months. It varies wildly depending on species and diet, but 18 inches for lots of blueys is full grown.

Remember - some sellers will say whatever people want to hear to make a sale. Young and CBB are on the top of that list. To ensure it is CBB ask about the breeder and ask to see pictures of the parents etc. But you are better off buying from a reputable breeder rather than supporting a pet store. Chances are the pet store isn't telling the full truth or else doesn't know the full truth!

[xxmonitorlizardxx]

One thing is very few people breed them. As far as I'm aware of, only 2 people have bred meruakes succesfully in the US. Many are trying though...

[James Wilson]

oh, and they said they got it in February, i forgot to mention, february at 6 inches

Feb is the birthing season for wild BTS as that is their summer in the southern hemisphere. So with that information it is safe to say it is not captive bred. However, it could have been captive born as in a wild collected gravid female gave birth to him. Every time I hear of this it makes me very sad. I really think that if they are going to allow wildcollecting, Laws should prohibit them from doing it durring the breeding and birthing seasons.

[Anderous]

thanks guys, I will ask them tomorrow. Im pretty good at telling when people are lying to me but i wasnt expecting to see a blue tongue so i wasnt as prepaired as i should have been. I guess if their lying to me ill just trash their name all over the internet lol. The Tropical Hut in Portland Oregon by the way, they go to a lot of shows so you may have seen them.

[Katrina]

thanks guys, I will ask them tomorrow. Im pretty good at telling when people are lying to me but i wasnt expecting to see a blue tongue so i wasnt as prepaired as i should have been. I guess if their lying to me ill just trash their name all over the internet lol. The Tropical Hut in Portland Oregon by the way, they go to a lot of shows so you may have seen them.

If you are in Oregon, Zach, the owner of this site, is also in Oregon (Eugene). You would be crazy not to buy from him or another breeder rather than a pet store! Shipping is also a good option for breeders out of state. No reason to buy an adult of unknown history when you can get a baby! James Wilson might have a baby or two left as well, and they are stunning.