Skinks from Indonesia

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Jeff
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Re: Skinks from Indonesia

Postby Jeff » Sun Jan 27, 2013 6:25 pm

Thank you too Dom. I appreciate your input. :jeff:
6.10.9 T. s. intermedia
2.2.7 T. s. scincoides
1.2.1 T. nigrolutea
2.2.0 T. r. rugosa
1.2.3 T.g. keyensis
2.0.5 T.s. chimaera
0.0.0. T. occipitalis
0.0.0. T. multifasciata
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Re: Skinks from Indonesia

Postby xxmonitorlizardxx » Sun Jan 27, 2013 6:26 pm

:cheers:
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Re: Skinks from Indonesia

Postby Jeff » Sun Jan 27, 2013 6:27 pm

Under age drinking will not be tolerated on this form J.J.!!!
6.10.9 T. s. intermedia
2.2.7 T. s. scincoides
1.2.1 T. nigrolutea
2.2.0 T. r. rugosa
1.2.3 T.g. keyensis
2.0.5 T.s. chimaera
0.0.0. T. occipitalis
0.0.0. T. multifasciata
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Re: Skinks from Indonesia

Postby Richard.C » Mon Jan 28, 2013 7:09 am

I think there snow cones jeff,it is ml after all,lol
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Re: Skinks from Indonesia

Postby Spindown » Sat Feb 02, 2013 6:02 pm

Hmmm, this has given me a lot to consider about my girl. I ended up choosing not to breed her this year, because my friend has a very "classic" looking male and I felt that it would be better to find one more like her.
I am now 110% convinced that I NEED THAT BOOK and need to save up to get it ASAP!

If you could clarify a point for me because i'm getting lost with all the abbreviations, Merauke and IJ are considered the same subspecies currently? Just with different looks?
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Re: Skinks from Indonesia

Postby Jeff » Sat Feb 02, 2013 6:40 pm

SapphireTigress wrote:
If you could clarify a point for me because i'm getting lost with all the abbreviations, Merauke and IJ are considered the same subspecies currently? Just with different looks?


Not by everyone, but some of the most respected members of the scientific community believe that IJ's should be considered a variant of T.g.evanescens (merauke) until enough research is done to determine if they deserve a new subspecies status.
6.10.9 T. s. intermedia
2.2.7 T. s. scincoides
1.2.1 T. nigrolutea
2.2.0 T. r. rugosa
1.2.3 T.g. keyensis
2.0.5 T.s. chimaera
0.0.0. T. occipitalis
0.0.0. T. multifasciata
http://www.btskinks.com
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Re: Skinks from Indonesia

Postby ssr » Sat Feb 02, 2013 7:26 pm

This thread has been very educational for me. Thanks for posting.
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Re: Skinks from Indonesia

Postby Scotts1au » Sun Feb 03, 2013 6:36 pm

I won't profess to know all of the details of scale counts etc. I am aware of Dr. Shae's thoughts on the matters but I think it comes down to a simple matter of geographic adaptation as to the amount of scincoides, vs. speciated gigas genetic present in each of the populations.

The land masses that we are talking about were connected as little as 3000 years ago and had been something like 6 times over the last million years representing many thousands of years of intermingling. I'm convinced that Tiliqua radiated out from mainland Australia to Northern climes and speciated to gigas from isolated island genetics during warmer periods which re-colonised the greater papua area - back into areas which were already populated with scincoides. Varying amounts of genetic intermingling would have occured, as I'm sure that the speciation was not 100% complete.

With those representing gigas genetics differentiating habitat preferences to lowland, hotter areas those with greater scincoides falling back to more temperate elevated climes. The degrees to which flow of genetics between populations would have occured, would have been a result in changes in climate and the relative extension or retreat, overlap of habitats and breeding trigger cues. Of course there are going to be populations which vary for many reasons, the climate, vegetation, soils, predation etc and to some degree the amount of genetics from one source or the other in the population - transitional gradations, or in some cases like Tanibars, stranded scincoides populations never exposed to "gigas" type genetics.

Anyway my 2cents worth.
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Re: Skinks from Indonesia

Postby xxmonitorlizardxx » Tue Feb 05, 2013 3:50 pm

Perhaps it could be like a locality thing like the Easterns and Kimberly Northerns?
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Re: Skinks from Indonesia

Postby Scotts1au » Thu Feb 07, 2013 9:30 pm

Relative geographic isolation.
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Re: Skinks from Indonesia

Postby kl » Fri Feb 08, 2013 12:51 pm

I hope this is not somewhat off topic though it relates to Indonesian species. Do any of the other Indonesian species display such huge differences in appearance as Kei Islands do. They have 2 distinctly different color variations, either very green/ gold colored, or rusty red colored. Nobody has ever confirmed if this was a variance based on which island they were found or if this variance can be found on the same islands.

KL
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Re: Skinks from Indonesia

Postby Lea » Sat Feb 09, 2013 10:46 am

Thank you for all this information! It's been easy for me, down in SA, with two very distinct species, the shingleback and the eastern, in my area. I hadn't given a lot of thought in to scale size/ formation, to help differentiate between the Indonesian species. This is a great thread for me to learn from. It makes me even more interested to see them in person, so I can properly identify these differences in an actual skink. :thumbs:
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Re: Skinks from Indonesia

Postby Jeff » Sat Feb 09, 2013 4:21 pm

kl wrote:I hope this is not somewhat off topic though it relates to Indonesian species. Do any of the other Indonesian species display such huge differences in appearance as Kei Islands do. They have 2 distinctly different color variations, either very green/ gold colored, or rusty red colored. Nobody has ever confirmed if this was a variance based on which island they were found or if this variance can be found on the same islands.

KL


Kim, I have never seen or heard any information about Kei locales other than the obvious islands they are limited to. I would like to know if distinct geographically isolated populations exist as well.

I would consider the differences in color among the Tanimbars to be as drastic as the Keis though. I'm not sure if you count them since they are scincoides. Among the other gigas animals, they vary more like easterns do rather that there being just a few distinct color phases. There are all kinds of colors and patterns, and almost every indo/merauke/IJ looks like a mix of two other gigas that fall somewhere along the continuum of the "non-Kei gigas look".
6.10.9 T. s. intermedia
2.2.7 T. s. scincoides
1.2.1 T. nigrolutea
2.2.0 T. r. rugosa
1.2.3 T.g. keyensis
2.0.5 T.s. chimaera
0.0.0. T. occipitalis
0.0.0. T. multifasciata
http://www.btskinks.com
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Bluetong ... 846297977#
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Re: Skinks from Indonesia

Postby kl » Sun Feb 10, 2013 8:30 am

It's surprising how little information we have on some of these Indonesian species. There are several islands that make up the Kei Islands but of course there does nobody other than trappers and the large exporters that might be able to answer the questions about the Keis and I'd doubt they would even care since prices from exporters are generally the same no matter what the species. Here are 2 examples of that color variation I was talking about.

KL
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Re: Skinks from Indonesia

Postby Spindown » Sun Feb 17, 2013 6:02 pm

:jawdrop: I want!
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